FFL Transfer Problem

[Anselmo 87]

After reading the Shore Shot statement on Facebook, it seems there is a lack of communication someplace. Shore Shot said they've reported this to the ATF as a possible straw purchase and now the ATF needs in investigate to determine whether the transfer can proceed.

 

Was this communicated to Mrs. DSD?

[DSD1026 48]

wow, i didnt see that until now. I asked the gun community a question about a problem we had and that's the response from this place? interesting. I still don't understand how this is considered a straw purchase simply because I answered his question to "what are you picking up?" and I answered that we were there to pick up a Maverick 88 Shotgun. Simply because i know OF the gun doesnt make it illegal. I never once spoke as if it were my weapon, because it is not. My wife wants to learn to shoot a shotgun, and what better way than to legally purchase one?

 

oh, and to their comment about "giving information on the shotgun", that is completely untrue other than I gave him the name of the product. I gave no information other than that. Also, I said BEFORE we came into the store that the firearm was my wife's when he called us in. (I specifically said "its my wife's").

 

disappointing that they felt they had to bring this into fb.. bummer

[z2886 0]

Aw Shitz got real now son.

[DSD1026 48]

After reading the Shore Shot statement on Facebook, it seems there is a lack of communication someplace. Shore Shot said they've reported this to the ATF as a possible straw purchase and now the ATF needs in investigate to determine whether the transfer can proceed.

 

Was this communicated to Mrs. DSD?

no, he specifically mentioned the NJ state police, which she contacted today and were told to call back on Monday during their normal business hours, which she will be doing.

 

honestly, this all seems like its getting blown WAY out of proportion..

[Underdog 1,593]

Perceptions are everything. I will be assisting my wife in getting her first gun in the next month or so, and I have learned a lesson through this experience. I will be going with her, but I will be careful as to not raise any red flags by talking too much, etc.

 

As a side note, I wonder if this situation would have been different had the husband had the FID and the wife came in and did all of the talking.

[Soju 153]

 

 

As a side note, I wonder if this situation would have been different had the husband had the FID and the wife came in and did all of the talking.

 

Or if NJ wasn't retarded and didn't have this dumb FPID system in the first place...

[Screwball 483]

I'm not surprised at the Facebook post... I'll agree, there are two sides to every story, but I'll side against a shabby store that I've personally had bad experiences with (if it was SS of a few years ago, I'd have sided with them; not in the current state). Hope the original posters get it all straightened out.

 

And since I guess they are watching this thread, I stopped using your shop months ago... after being treated like garbage by your employees, and then having one try to get more "fees" out of a Davidson's transfer... which I've had family members also notice in other purchases. Your loss, since I do tend to buy multiple firearms each year. Best thing that could have happen, since I now use a FFL that is honest and trustworthy (Paul at NJ Arms).

[Anselmo 87]

 

 

As a side note, I wonder if this situation would have been different had the husband had the FID and the wife came in and did all of the talking.

 

Shore Shot stated that they would have the transfer if the husband had an FID but that would still not have mitigated a straw purchase. It would still be a straw purchase if the wife had the NICS in order to get the firearm for her husband who might not have passed NICS.

[pjd832 146]

disappointing that they felt they had to bring this into fb.. bummer

An attempt at damage control?....who posted first you or them?.....I've never been to the shop or had any dealings with them at all...and I don't know you either....but it seems strange that they would freak out without a reason and start all the drama.....perhaps you not having a fid and speaking on her behalf came across as a red flag to them...add the current climate ... And them possibly being overly cautious.... There is usually 3sides to any story...Hope it all works out for the best

[SmokeEater67 0]

OK i read this thread and the FB page. Sounds like a miss understanding that is spiralling out of control. You are mad they put it on FB but that was after someone on this page posted that you came on here bashing them so IMO you brought it to a public forum so they did the same. Also I see all these people saying I will be careful when I bring my wife.... I wouldnt cause i have a permit so it wouldnt "look" like a straw purchase. I'm not saying that is what was happening! Lets look at somewhat recent events. A girl bought a gun for someone and he killed two people then himself with it. Do I think they may be being over carefull maybe (if you can be) but if something did happen like that again can they hold SS responsible can they take there FFL away and shut them down? Can they make an example of them? I dont know but maybe a phone call to SP will starighten everything out and there is a couple day longer of a wait (yes I know you paid for it and that sucks) but we are in NJ so we should be use to waiting for permits and such. I dont like waiting 4-7days for a nics check but thats what we are dealing with right now cause of the time. I do agree DSD if you arent happy you should take your buisness elsewhere. I actually choose the place across the street as my range as well. I do understand that they wont send the gun to another FFL but they should return it to the orginall seller if they arent going to give it to the buyer.

[tt-33 8]

I dont know if this is to far along with njsp but find a ffl that will go to the store and pick up the gun in person and do the transfer you will have to pay them for thier time.im sure phil at brick armory would be interested due to the fact they hate each other.if you plan on future purchases find a better ffl i use castronovas gun garage in freehold for my last 3 transfers

[Anselmo 87]

Shore Shot said they took training in how to spot a straw purchase and, in their opinion, this was a text book example. The FFL has a responsibility as a gatekeeper so that is part of their job to not just rubber stamp every transfer. Their training must have included: what to do when you suspect a straw purchase. This is where thing broke down. Within an hour on their FB page they went from waiting on ATF to ok the transfer to sending the shotgun back to the seller.

[DSD1026 48]

look, my wife is going to call the SP Monday, and maybe this will much ado about nothing in the end. I posted on here to ask opinions about the situation. I certainly didnt post anything on FB.

 

I get that they are trying to cover their asses, but I am going to stop posting anything in here about this because apparently everything being said here is apparently being posted on FB and its not really worth it.

 

If my wife gets resolution with the SP, then great. If not, then hopefully they will send the gun back to the seller and we'll call it a day and not get anything until I get my FPID.. (which is apparently the major road block)

[JonF 79]

Funny, this is the second thread in about a week of an FFL going nuts about something that's clearly NOT a straw purchase.

 

Sounds like the ATF has been poking FFLs. My tinfoil hat is getting tighter.

 

I was discussing this with another FFL that i'm personal friends with and he was telling me that recent ATF/NJSP FFL training seminars have been putting a lot of emphasis on straw purchase identification lately. An actual straw purchase is clearly defined as to what it is, however, lately, authorities have been *Stretching* the definition from beyond the "*ADMITTEDLY NOT* the actual purchaser/recipient", to "*KINDA SEEMS LIKE* its not the actual purchaser/recipient". I'm told that they really have dealers SPOOKED on this topic because of all the wacky scenarios they gave as examples of thier stretched perception of a straw purchase.

 

One case cited to me was a father goes into a store to buy a simple starter 22lr rifle and in casual conversation with the owner, mentions that its "for his kid". Literally meaning, he's buying it so he can bring his kid to the range and have something for the child to shoot. Never said it was to "Give" posession of it to the child, rather, just for use at the range under his supervision. To them this is a straw purchase even though the intention is not to give it away. This is comflicted because gifting a firearms is still allowed and its this is not considered a straw purchase, does that incriminate every single parent who has purchased or intends to purchase a CHIPMUNK 22 youth rifle so thier kid can learn to shoot? Ridiculous!

 

And now cases like these where a married couple goes in the store *TOGETHER* (cuz thats what marries couples DO!) to pick up a gun that one of them bought for themselves and one person speaks on the others behalf because he's more comfortable/knowledgable/etc now *SEEMS* like its not the actual recipeint so suddenly its tagged as a straw purchase.

 

Like said, the issuing authorities have the dealers spooked by stretching the envelope for the definition. So natrually all the high volume dealers and the newbies with little experience are going to flag anything that seems like it now.

[Kingsoverqueens 10]

So natrually all the high volume dealers and the newbies with little experience are going to flag anything that seems like it now.

All the more reason to establish a relationship with a single FFL, who knows you, your family, your shooting habits.

[silverado427 10,788]

I've got a permit to burn up and i was thinking about shore shot. Thanks for the heads up, I like venders who treat people with some respect...

[bbk 188]

Ah, Shore Shots catching the back-end again. Honestly, I don't care much for their business, but I don't hold anything against them for what they did here. And, ultimately, no one on this forum (or anywhere in the world for that matter), with the exception of the couple and Shore Shots, really know the truth of the matter... so, why are we still commentating?

 

Now, some of the comments by Shore Shots on their FB page/post are pretty stupid. The logic of attacking someone's response by dredging up past history is illogical and quite juvenile. Still, I don't really care, and, beyond literal actions, they don't register anymore on my radar as there are far more reliable and personable FFLs out there that I'd rather give my money.

[Maksim 1,504]

actually it seems SS posted that thread on their facebook.... after people called in after reading it here.

[SmokeEater67 0]

look, my wife is going to call the SP Monday, and maybe this will much ado about nothing in the end. I posted on here to ask opinions about the situation. I certainly didnt post anything on FB.

 

I get that they are trying to cover their asses, but I am going to stop posting anything in here about this because apparently everything being said here is apparently being posted on FB and its not really worth it.

 

The reason it is being talked about on FB is someone posted this to thier FB look at original link on FB. Now anyone (even non NJGF members) can see this thread on here from that link. Yet only NJGF members can post here but anyone friends with SS on FB can post to thier page after reading on here.

[SmokeEater67 0]

actually it seems SS posted that thread on their facebook.... after people called in after reading it here.

 

Shore Shot Pistol Range shared a link via Mike Beck. not sure if he works there or not I dont know there staff. It seams that is the link from this forum to the FB page

[Smokin .50 1,907]

OMG, THIS THREAD IS A TRAIN WRECK!

 

If both the husband and the wife have NJFID and can produce a DL with the same address as is on their respective NJFID's, how is this even remotely thought to be a "straw purchase".

 

So let me see if I get this right: I'm looking for a shotty and the Wife knows it. I find one and talk to her about it. She calls the FFL and has it shipped in her name as a "surprise" gift. We go to the store together, we each produce NJFID and try to pay for the shotty. Then some A-Hole declares it "ipso-facto" as a "straw purchase"? THAT IS JUST NUTS!

 

One more reason why I just buy or order stuff at retail. How is it that in close to 45 years of shooting, I only needed an independent FFL just once--WHEN MY WIFE GIFTED ME A SHOTGUN FOR CHRISTMAS! And she "bought it out of a catalog" with S&H Greenstamps close to 30 years ago!

 

THIS WHOLE SITUATION IS CRAPTASTICALLY OUT OF CONTROL!

 

Dave

[SmokeEater67 0]

OMG, THIS THREAD IS A TRAIN WRECK!

 

If both the husband and the wife have NJFID and can produce a DL with the same address as is on their respective NJFID's, how is this even remotely thought to be a "straw purchase".

 

THIS WHOLE SITUATION IS CRAPTASTICALLY OUT OF CONTROL!

 

Dave

 

Thing is husband DOESNT have a NJFID!

[M4BGRINGO 139]

Too funny. Train came off the tracks and is headed over the mountains edge...........Someone explain how this was a "Straw Purchase". Doesn't matter to who paid for the gun, what matters is who is taking possession of the gun. If the OP paid for it, but his wife is using her FID and ID to take possession of it, it is now HER gun and HER responsibility. If hubby (OP) decides to take the gun to a local range without a valid FID, then that is his problem now isn't it. Then again, does he even need an FID to take a long gun to a range? If he is a prohibited person, then we have a whole new ballgame. In the meantime, no, I am NOT an employee there, nor would I ever step into that dump ever again. Tiny and one of their RO's are the only two useful people they have there, the rest can kma.

[Tactical Turtle 11]

Just call them up they will tell you what a straw purchase is haha. Ill call them in the am and ask them to. This is bs... contact who she bought it from and have them get the gun back.. have them ship it to another ffl who has a clue and if shore shot as you to lay for nics tell them to lick your balls

[Smokin .50 1,907]

OMG, THIS THREAD IS A TRAIN WRECK!

 

If both the husband and the wife have NJFID and can produce a DL with the same address as is on their respective NJFID's, how is this even remotely thought to be a "straw purchase".

 

So let me see if I get this right: I'm looking for a shotty and the Wife knows it. I find one and talk to her about it. She calls the FFL and has it shipped in her name as a "surprise" gift. We go to the store together, we each produce NJFID and try to pay for the shotty. Then some A-Hole declares it "ipso-facto" as a "straw purchase"? THAT IS JUST NUTS!

 

One more reason why I just buy or order stuff at retail. How is it that in close to 45 years of shooting, I only needed an independent FFL just once--WHEN MY WIFE GIFTED ME A SHOTGUN FOR CHRISTMAS! And she "bought it out of a catalog" with S&H Greenstamps close to 30 years ago!

 

THIS WHOLE SITUATION IS CRAPTASTICALLY OUT OF CONTROL!

 

Dave

 

O-K, I thought they both had FID, so MY BAD. Still a train wreck since gun has her name on it from the supplier. Wife can buy 20 in the same day so what's the problem?

 

I call sexist Chicken-Sh!t tactics! Let the NJSP call Shore Shot to clear it up.

 

BOGUS & a waste of time too!

[DSD1026 48]

Wife paid for it, filled out paperwork, showed her fpid when filling out the paperwork and I'm not planning on touching it until I get my fpid.. If I had any inkling that they might have had a problem with me answering their question, I wouldn't have gone with her.. Simple as that

 

Nothing getting resolved until she calls the sp on Monday then we'll see what happens..

[SmokeEater67 0]

Too funny. Train came off the tracks and is headed over the mountains edge...........Someone explain how this was a "Straw Purchase". Doesn't matter to who paid for the gun, what matters is who is taking possession of the gun. If the OP paid for it, but his wife is using her FID and ID to take possession of it, it is now HER gun and HER responsibility. If hubby (OP) decides to take the gun to a local range without a valid FID, then that is his problem now isn't it. Then again, does he even need an FID to take a long gun to a range? If he is a prohibited person, then we have a whole new ballgame. In the meantime, no, I am NOT an employee there, nor would I ever step into that dump ever again. Tiny and one of their RO's are the only two useful people they have there, the rest can kma.

 

I dont work there either but I think thier fear maybe what happen in webster NY girl bought gun gave to neighbor he killed his sister set fire to house killed two fireman that responded and then killed himself. Also NJ law you need a FID even for long guns. I do agree that I think this got out of control to bad everyone couldn't have just talked it out with out going extreme but I guess SP will handle it monday which ever way it goes. Hopefully they say owner gets her gun

[O-gre 7]

So stating that I'm buying a gun that my sons can shoot at the range with me is a "straw purchase"? That's F**** nuts!

[tt-33 8]

it does matter who pays for it .if we went to a store and I was buying a gun did all the paper work and said I for got my wallet and you handed me a wad of cash and said repay me when we get back to my house end of sale, ive had a pink card and shot sales down like this .i am not defending shore shot they are a bunch of smack talking idiots I worked for a competitor of thiers and we had a customer who had a problem with them and I was sent to pick up 10 hand guns while waiting for them to process everything I had to listen to the owner tell me what an a hole the customer was and his even bigger a hole brother in law on and on funny thing was the guy was an excellent customer

[N2BRK 0]

I'm no lawyer, but if they are married, then wouldn't the gun be legally BOTH of theirs anyway? I know in many instances husband and wife are legally the same person. It sure makes it a HARD argument for SS that this is a suspected straw purchase. It's not like two friends living together and shopping.