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Indianajonze

Brownells Suddenly Requiring FID To Ship Ammo To NJ

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placed a routine order for ammo from brownells the other day. today i receive this lovely note:

On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 2:21 PM, <ammorestrictions@brownells.com> wrote:

Thank you for your recent purchase, your order contains ammunition and it is holding for the required documents. Brownells complies with all State, local and Federal laws regarding ammunition. Current NJ ammo restrictions require Brownells to obtain a copy of one of the following to ship Handgun ammo:
· NJ firearm purchaser ID
· Handgun purchase permit
· Handgun carry permit
· Law Enforcement ID
· Military ID 
· Any Federal Firearms License “FFL” (except 03)- If you are not the FFL holder, authorization is required 
 
The above documentation can be faxed to 641-623-8114 or emailed to ammorestrictions@brownells.com. Thank you.
 
We will hold the order for 3 additional business days. 
 
 

i responded with the following

New Jersey has no such laws. I would carefully double check this request if I were you and read or update the info on your own site. I've spent thousands of dollars at Brownells on ammo and have never been asked for my FID. It's attached, but as I said I'd double check on this request as you're going to lose a LOT of business needlessly...

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FID, P2P, or carry permit needed to purchase handgun ammo.
No such paperwork needed for rifle or shotgun ammo.

That's in the law.

If an out of state online seller wishes to require or not such ID, that's on them.
If such a vendor had what I wanted I can choose to provide the needed info, or not.

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9 minutes ago, Zeke said:

Why did you attach FPID? Jus curious...

 

well they're generally a great company and i've done a lot of business with them so i guess i gave them a pass. pretty much anyone else and i'd tell them to piss off and go elsewhere

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8 minutes ago, sota said:

FID, P2P, or carry permit needed to purchase handgun ammo.
No such paperwork needed for rifle or shotgun ammo.

That's in the law.

If an out of state online seller wishes to require or not such ID, that's on them.
If such a vendor had what I wanted I can choose to provide the needed info, or not.

what's in the law is that it is specifically for dealers in the state of new jersey. no such requirement for out of state dealers. hence, not the law...

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3 minutes ago, Indianajonze said:

well they're generally a great company and i've done a lot of business with them so i guess i gave them a pass. pretty much anyone else and i'd tell them to piss off and go elsewhere

Some vendors require it some don’t. Idk. I have it so I don’t care. Long down my list of things that need to repealed in this state I currently reside in

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47 minutes ago, Indianajonze said:

what's in the law is that it is specifically for dealers in the state of new jersey. no such requirement for out of state dealers. hence, not the law...

I don’t think the law is specific. There are cases where the AG of other state filing lawsuits to get out of state companies to comply with their laws. 

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Because you guys come on here bragging how you buy your ammo at great prices online without needing to show an FID. Then you list all the sites that sell to you without an FID. Whatever branch of NJ government that monitors this site takes notes. Now they went around to all the sites you listed and either told them or threatened them to require an copy of your FID. Targetsportsusa just started this also. Good going.  

Remember, you are a prisoner of this State you live in. 

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it's new for brownells. anyway i've been going back and forth with whoever is answering that ammorestrictions@brownells.com email address. they're insisting it's the law:

Here is the law upon which our NJ ammunition shipping restriction is based:
 
2C:58-3.3 1(b): No person shall sell, give, transfer, assign or otherwise dispose of, or receive, purchase, or otherwise acquire handgun ammunition unless the purchaser, assignee, donee, receiver or holder is licensed as a manufacturer, wholesaler, or dealer under this chapter or is the holder of and possesses a valid firearms purchaser identification card, a valid copy of a permit to purchase a handgun, or a valid permit to carry a handgun and first exhibits such card or permit to the seller, donor, transferor or assignor.
 
doesn't explain why 1. it's not reflected on their policies page or 2. how i've been able to order ammo from them without providing one for the past several years

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this happens to me just about every time i order any kind of ammunition online (not just handgun) i assume the shipper is just trying to cover theyre ass because of how ridiculous some states laws are, and staying on top of all current laws in the rabid anti gun states its easier to just add restrictions on theyre end  shipping policy from a place i just ordered from last week - 

AMMUNITION ORDERS

No shipments of ammo to: AK, CA, CT, DC, HI, IL, MA, NY.

In NJ: you must email FID + DL before ordering.

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I just don't buy ammo from any site that requires it. Problem solved.

....and in most cases, you will either not get handgun ammo and/or good prices.

Sportsmans Guide starting doing the same dumb things years ago. They will not even send NJ any AR stuff. Even if its just a 2” rail riser.
I stopped buying from them because of that and I spent boat loads of cash with them prior.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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1 minute ago, Jerseybones said:

Began to notice this when they started calling .22 rim fire and .410 shotshells "handgun" ammo. I don't care much that they want ID my big concern is that they have all these ID numbers and their data bases are NOT secure. 

Couldn’t be worse than AIM, which resulted in plenty of licenses, FIDs, and FFLs being taken... mine included.

For as much as I am despising MidwayUSA, they did it in a better way (or used to). If you went through the rifle section, you could get ammo like .44 Magnum without FID. Don’t think they did the same with 9mm, but was something I noticed.

Still think it is all stupid, as NJ jurisdiction stops at the Delaware River.

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On 2/16/2018 at 3:33 PM, Indianajonze said:

placed a routine order for ammo from brownells the other day. today i receive this lovely note:

On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 2:21 PM, <ammorestrictions@brownells.com> wrote:

Thank you for your recent purchase, your order contains ammunition and it is holding for the required documents. Brownells complies with all State, local and Federal laws regarding ammunition. Current NJ ammo restrictions require Brownells to obtain a copy of one of the following to ship Handgun ammo:
· NJ firearm purchaser ID
· Handgun purchase permit
· Handgun carry permit
· Law Enforcement ID
· Military ID 
· Any Federal Firearms License “FFL” (except 03)- If you are not the FFL holder, authorization is required 
 
The above documentation can be faxed to 641-623-8114 or emailed to ammorestrictions@brownells.com. Thank you.
 
We will hold the order for 3 additional business days. 
 
 

i responded with the following

New Jersey has no such laws. I would carefully double check this request if I were you and read or update the info on your own site. I've spent thousands of dollars at Brownells on ammo and have never been asked for my FID. It's attached, but as I said I'd double check on this request as you're going to lose a LOT of business needlessly...

Good luck to them in getting a copy of a Military ID.  That would be illegal.

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cheaper Than Dirt and Brownells can both go fly a kite if they are asking anything more than NJ needs.  Bendover for NJ, Bendover for them... Might as well stay bent over.  

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I don't understand why so many people get bent out of shape for places asking for the FID card.  I don't agree with the state requirement to have the card, but I don't take it out on companies that feel they are trying to cover their own asses, even if they don't completely understand that NJ stupid laws do not apply to them.  I jumped through the hoops to get the card and now I got it.  So if I buy ammo, a gun, etc whether it be online or in a gun store and someone asks to see the card, well here it is because I got it for that reason.  I rather show it to them and carry on with the transaction and be thankful they only ask for the card and not be one of the companies that says "fuck NJ residence altogether, we're not shipping them as much as a grain of black powder."  

And someone dug up this post from last year.   

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Why, because we shouldn't even have to have an FID card.  And since we are required by an Unkonstitional State that requires so much BS from law-abiding and good citizens, we shouldn't have to do more than we need to for these businesses.  If you come into my business, can I ask you for your Social Security number?  Many people with older FIDs have this on them.  As the purchaser, I am responsible for MY actions.  When you buy a car are you asked for your license to see if you have any DWIs, or other tickets?   Maybe gas stations should ask you for your license before giving you gas to see if your license is suspended?   When does it stop?  When do people stop getting into the business of others?  

For example, don't make Slung Shot, or Sling Shots illegal.  Make it illegal to commit a crime with them.   Don't make purchasing ammo or guns illegal, punish those that use them in an a violent or dangerous manner with suitable sentences.  

We are NOT suppose to ask the State for permission to exercise a right.  Driving is NOT a right, but a privilege.  Owning a firearm and ammunition for it is NOT a privilege granted by amazing geniuses that run everything, but rather a right that isn't suppose to be infringed upon, taxed, etc.  and I guess it is OK for companies to keep you off their law if you don't have a leash.

 

As a side note, I don't think you have to have an FID card to own firearms in NJ... maybe to transport them. 

Why do people think it is OK for the government to keep track of their every move?    And, what if you move and you are waiting for a NEW FID w/ your updated address on it.  I know of some jurisdictions that have taken months to issue an address or name change.  So, during that time I cannot buy Ammo?  I cannot transport my firearms, etc.  I guess some are OK with wearing leashes and being curbed.

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On 2/16/2018 at 8:41 PM, bhunted said:


....and in most cases, you will either not get handgun ammo and/or good prices.

Sportsmans Guide starting doing the same dumb things years ago. They will not even send NJ any AR stuff. Even if its just a 2” rail riser.
I stopped buying from them because of that and I spent boat loads of cash with them prior.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That was why I stopped shopping with them and didn't renew my membership.  I don't shop at Dicks heads either.

They will all sell out and let you down given the opportunity.. Ruger, S&W, Springfield Armory....    

Find outlets that support your Constitutional Rights even if you have to pay more, and let them know.  LL Bean can fly a kite, too.  Statism and liberalism infect everything.

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43 minutes ago, Underdog said:

Why, because we shouldn't even have to have an FID card.  And since we are required by an Unkonstitional State that requires so much BS from law-abiding and good citizens, we shouldn't have to do more than we need to for these businesses.  If you come into my business, can I ask you for your Social Security number?  Many people with older FIDs have this on them.  As the purchaser, I am responsible for MY actions.  When you buy a car are you asked for your license to see if you have any DWIs, or other tickets?   Maybe gas stations should ask you for your license before giving you gas to see if your license is suspended?   When does it stop?  When do people stop getting into the business of others?  

For example, don't make Slung Shot, or Sling Shots illegal.  Make it illegal to commit a crime with them.   Don't make purchasing ammo or guns illegal, punish those that use them in an a violent or dangerous manner with suitable sentences.  

We are NOT suppose to ask the State for permission to exercise a right.  Driving is NOT a right, but a privilege.  Owning a firearm and ammunition for it is NOT a privilege granted by amazing geniuses that run everything, but rather a right that isn't suppose to be infringed upon, taxed, etc.  and I guess it is OK for companies to keep you off their law if you don't have a leash.

 

As a side note, I don't think you have to have an FID card to own firearms in NJ... maybe to transport them. 

Why do people think it is OK for the government to keep track of their every move?    And, what if you move and you are waiting for a NEW FID w/ your updated address on it.  I know of some jurisdictions that have taken months to issue an address or name change.  So, during that time I cannot buy Ammo?  I cannot transport my firearms, etc.  I guess some are OK with wearing leashes and being curbed.

I agree 100% with you that the state's unconstitutional laws that cause the problem.  I'm not OK with it, which is why I'm a life member of the NRA and member of ANJRPC, which are fighting against these ridiculous state laws.  I even said in my post that I don't agree with the state law that we need to have a FID card.  Having the card means we have to ask the state for permission to use our 2A right.  It's a right, not a privilege that has to be asked for.  The state is the problem.

What I'm saying I don't understand is how it helps to boycott a private business for asking for the card.  That doesn't solve the problem of the state unconstitutional laws.  Nothing you posted explains any logic to this.  I know they don't need to ask for the card, but I also get that they don't know or don't feel comfortable with all of NJ fucked up laws so they feel safer asking for it.  But I guess I focus on the state laws being the problem and the businesses asking for the card to be a side effect.  As for the older cards having SSN on it, I did not know that.  It's not on mine and I've never heard anyone mention that fact when they bring up this subject.     

Now Dick's Sporting Goods, fuck them.  I don't shop there.  Besides them donating money to anti-2A campaigns, I have personal issues with them from personal experience.  But places like Brownells that have done nothing but ask for the card, I don't see how boycotting them does anything to help our situation with the state laws.  

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2 hours ago, Regular Guy said:

And someone dug up this post from last year.   

the good news there is that now i can come back and let everyone know that in addition to the id card jackassery, brownells has now started charging sales tax. started noticing it a couple of weeks ago

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Ok so lets pretend we dont have FID cards, they dont exist....   if an online dealer just required ID to prove age, because after all there is a federal age requirement to purchase ammo.... so then your ok with giving them a copy of your DL or passport, but our FID card, you refuse to show that?  Then what?  You would refuse to buy ammo online all together? I doubt that.  im with regular guy on this.  If a vendor actively works against our rights like Dicks..  then f-them ... I get that .. but because an online dealer wants to make sure they follow all state and federal laws so they dont get sued and shutdown, you have a problem with that?  Its not their fault our state sucks the big donkey D.    Let's be grateful they dont just write us all off completely and refuse to sell/ship anything to NJ.  That can happen just as easily if they decided they dont want to deal with the hassle. 

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5 minutes ago, Indianajonze said:

the good news there is that now i can come back and let everyone know that in addition to the id card jackassery, brownells has now started charging sales tax. started noticing it a couple of weeks ago

taxes... yea .. well that is now the law.

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