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I think @Zeke was referring to a more recent controversy...? The link you provided was the one the CDC released during the Obama administration - in which, on the one hand, they admitted DGU's were "common" - but on the other hand, they hemmed and hawed and said "gee, the studies vary widely... we really need more studies to validate this" etc. Within the last few days, it turns out that one of the top researchers, Gary Kleck, whose studies show DGUs are very common... stumbled upon UNPUBLISHED data from the CDC. The CDC had added DGU questions to some large sweeping survey and conducted it 3 years in a row. Their findings appear to align with Kleck's data - and yet they NEVER published it. So, think about that for a minute - to be squawking "we need more data to validate this" - but then to SIT on your own data that does validate it. It seems they buried their own data because it showed something they didn't want to see - data that didn't align with the agency's known anti-gun stance. Here's one of the articles describing the recent controversy: https://www.ammoland.com/2018/04/cdc-failed-to-report-strong-evidence-of-defensive-gun-uses/#axzz5EML6LUus

I thought it was pretty good and she almost made a connection that I never see in any article, the AR-15 type rifle is the number 1 rifle format sold in the US. They always have to throw in that AR-15 style rifles were used in mass shootings. To me that's a lot like saying the F-150 is the number 1 selling pickup in the US and then the F-150 is the number one stolen pickup in the US. Well, duh. If there's more of one type of anything out in the world then any other, the chances are that item is going to see more usage both good and bad. It's like when they say "people that go to shoot at the range regularly are more likely to get injured at the range then someone who doesn't go to the range" again duh... -Jim

I'm putting this in a public forum... keep the language clean, pls. There's been several articles on here about activists (like Gov Cuomo) pressuring banks to step away from business with firearm manufacturers. Here's a new twist... in retribution, Hornady has said they won't sell any ammo to NY state's various agencies. Geez, how I would LOVE to see all the other manufacturers do the same thing... and then see them get raped and pillaged on price by the ones who will still deal with them. It's a lot to hope for... but, here's wishin' and a hopin'. https://bearingarms.com/tom-k/2018/04/30/hornady-takes-stand-bullying-state-new-york/

If it were today Murphy would have me reported on a list as bringing beer from other states to NJ endangering the undocumented immigrants lives because they would end up drunk driving with their new drivers licenses to their hamburger flipping 15.00/hr jobs that they hope to leave after their free college. But I would be the criminal.

Stingers have screwed up more guns. The brass is longer than a regular 22LR and most, virtually all, chambers are not designed to handle them. This puts the bullet into the lands and pressure goes way up and accuracy way down. Waste of time and money. Not to mention the beating the bolt and receiver do to the receiver.

Just common sense Sent from an undisclosed location via Tapatalk

These will work as well. Just a bugger to put into place unless you use a little grease. https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/receiver-parts/recoil-parts/recoil-buffers/ruger-10-22-bolt-buffer-prod26667.aspx

So it’s not a fake suppressor it’s a vaporizer?

And in case you haven't noticed, Ms Parks doesn't use the term assault rifle anywhere in the article. Not once.

The finite balance of thermodynamics, pythagorean theorem and their intersect in calculus.

Soooooo... I went down this rabbit hole to a pretty significant degree. I will skip all my boring research and cut to my findings. ALL of which are my opinion and open to interpretation and additionally could be entirely wrong. But people I talked to, experts in the field of combat optics, helped me form this opinion. Your performance with a LPV vs a red dot may have nothing to do with the optics themselves. Its a software issue. Your performance is dependant on the sight picture your brain will accept vs what the optic is doing. Now that I know this I can watch out for it when someone is having trouble with a LPV. What I find is that they are way more critical of their aim with a red dot in a scope instead of the red dot of say an aimpoint because its not a scope. They have to learn to use it like an aimpoint and only see what you need to see to break the shot. Tactical Monkey and I did a LOT of testing with probably about 10k in optics on the table, simple repeatable drills from MDTS, and a timer. A lot of our data just didnt add up! Again for brevity, TM and I are comparable shooters. But the times between ourselves and Red Dots vs cross hairs vs horseshoes etc etc varied significantly! So varied it simply didnt make sense at all. What really showed this was the Acogs. My speeds as distance shrunk did not fall off nearly as much as TM's. Stark differences. The reason, his brain would not accept the sight picture. Same thing happened with the LPV's, just not as dramatic. My brain had no issue with the sight pic so the performance difference between a red dot and a LPV at 1x was fractions of a second. Now TM's Brain craves a red dot. So his performance with the red dot was very consistent. My brain actually seems to prefer reticles. So my performance varied more with the RDS.

I’m not really sure how the bank can do this. I would like to assume lending laws might prevail here. If the business is a legal one and the financial risk is minimal I don’t feel the bank should have the right to judge. Do they take the same moral high road for a bar with nude dancers? A porn shop? A building loan for a planned parenthood building? Where’s the line and how can they cross it? There’re loan grants should be based on business decisions and not moral or political ones.

I don’t blame her for any gaffes. It’s obscenely complicated to be a gun owner here. Even those of us who’ve had guns in NJ for years are still unclear on some aspects. Kudos @Katie Park for your efforts to reach out to us and put out a fair piece of content. I doubt it’ll change anyone’s perspective, but it’s good to have out there.

I think this is about as fair and well-written an article as you'll get from a journalist... which, in some sense, is shocking to see in a NJ newspaper. I think Katie hit it out of the "Park". Frankly, I hope this raises her curiosity and makes her interested in writing more articles. We need "reasonable" coverage of these issues. Most of the articles I've seen have been hack jobs. As far as some of the finer points you may disagree with... that's your cue to write in and comment on the article and bring out other relevant facts and statistics.

Well our girl Katie Park the reporter finally got her story out. https://www.app.com/story/news/politics/new-jersey/2018/05/01/how-buy-gun-nj-new-jersey-permit-laws/448221002/

Its not about recoil its about neutral muzzle movement. And its only a facet of that equation. If you dont have good technique, it wont matter. If your not interested in putting rounds on target FAST in as close to shot 1 as possible, it wont matter for you.

Okay. You're good. You can stay.

if you get one can I shoot it?

Even more kudos to Hornady then.

https://www.steiner-optics.com/riflescopes/p4xi-1-4x24 I picked mine up for $450 from DSG Arms and threw it in an Aero lightweight mount.

I was living in Colorado Springs during all that. I used to smuggle as many cases as one could fit in the trunk of a ‘72 Monte Carlo Back to NJ people willing to buy it. I thought I remember it differently in the headlines but a lot is blurry from the 70s.

They weren’t forced to distribute, but could not prevent 3rd party distribution. i don’t think it has bearing here unless hornady tries to prevent 3rd party from selling to its blacklist

Yup. That movie and Paul Newman opened a whole can of worms for Coors.

Smokey and the bandit

@Mrs. Peel is correct

I would agree there are more players on the field. I dont entirely disagree with your point. I DO remain skeptical of their durability. BUT not everyone needs that durability and you may not need it for every firearm in your safe. My go to guns all have proven optics. But I am asked so frequently about budget optics and have nothing to offer so I bought a few that looked to me to be a solid offering at a reasonable price point. Those two were a Holosun and the Steiner P4XI. In case you were unaware, it looks like you can get the Steiner for about $70 more than the PA 1-8. So I would consider these comparable price points. With that being said, I think the P4XI was in the $700 range when it came out but I think the foreign competition is driving down the price of the big boys. That could be good, or it could be bad if the big boys start cutting corners in premium optics to chase market share.

Pork roll. I'm originally from Central Jersey near the beach so it's Pork Roll for us.

My absolute favorites are Baba-Buis. You can't beat them. Sorry couldn't resist.

So you managed to disappoint two women at the same time?

I would but i made that mistake once and the member i shared the email with distributed it to pretty much everyone.... So i no longer share emails LOL Its not confidential but it was a 2 person conversation... You can always email them if you want to ask a question.

no, but there is the likelyhood that you'll hafta spend bunches of money defending yourself should they ever see them. yea, i'm paranoid.

I used to be an expert. Then I got married. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Not sure you are ok but your mags are legal LOL

Thanks @remixer I always just wanna make sure im ok. After all NJ is after our guns and rights anyways.

The Federal ammo contracts spread the wealth. They may buy 40 from Federal, 223 from Winchester, 9mm from CCI. and 12 GA from Remington. To ALL, not just GRIZ: From the Wild Hair up my keester Dept.: Without going down the entire rabbit hole of potential bid-rigging, is it possible, that the main suppliers to the Feds TAKE TURNS manufacturing for these huge contracts and do so based upon their lines' pre-set production limits, storage capacity, inventory on-hand, PM schedules of certain production lines (say the 9mm line will be down for overhaul?), new equipment installation plans in the works, etc., etc.? It's not collusion if you all "take turns" and TALK TO EACH OTHER about who needs to do what! It's not price-fixing either. It's simply GOOD BIDNESS and it's also great for National Security in that cooperation among manufacturers helps to offset a sudden need for small arms ammo should we find ourselves in another "shooting War". I'm a student of History. There's a REASON a typewriter company (Smith-Corona) was handed copyrighted plans that were patented by another company so they could RE-TOOL and make M-1 Garands. Several different companies in fact (cue Capt14K for full list). In today's world, NOBODY wants to tell DOD or the Joint Chiefs that they can't supply small arms ammo... So now that the manufacturing of small arms ammo comes under the purview of National Security, who wants to boycott which major manufacturer that chooses to fulfill their multi-year contracts?

According to the NJSP... if the mag is listed by the manufacture to be 10 or 15nds its legal. IE SW mp9 15nd mags have a bit of extra spring coiled on the bottom.. cut that out and you have 17 again. take any 15rd mag and cut off a few loops and it will hold more... You are changing its intended capacity...

Do not I repeat do not look to gunboards for advice on PU Snipers. There are maybe a handful of members left there that know what they are talking about. You want the correct info join RMNF. There are a whole lot of fake PU Snipers out there. Also You can get a nice PU Sniper still for just under $1,000. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

something of the sort, yes. perhaps just a black hole to another realm.

Welcome. Serious question, do you call it pork roll or Taylor Ham?

Soooo quadratic

@Katie Park Great job on your article. Thanks for writing a factual article about firearms, and firearms owners. DT

We need an engaged gay gun owner to protest.

To expand this a bit, it would be really great if firearm manufacturers refused to enter into contracts to supply firearms to any State and its political subdivisions that are hostile to the second amendment and have enacted draconian firearm laws, such as New Jersey. I assume Glock, Sig and S&W provide the majority of weapons to law enforcement and department members would not be happy if they had to carry second tier weapons. Didn't Magpul relocate from an anti State to a pro-State.

Read about this on another forum. I, along with several other members, have sent Remington, Winchester, CCI, and Federal an e-mail expressing our support for Hornady's decision and encouraged them to do the same. This is my "form letter"

I'm very happy to see them fight back! I hope many others follow suit very soon. I suddenly feel the urge to buy some more Hornady ammo!

I don't use or need BUIS. Not necessary. Optics never fail. If batteries die, change them. If you dropped your rifle on the optic and it breaks, buy another. What's the emergency? Is there someone after you? Do you expect to go to battle with the Popo? Please. Okay. I understand the fantasy commando world you live in and that you can't have real guns. So you load up your guns with extra bullshit feel good accessories which doubles the weight, but does nothing for accuracy. Unlike this post Zeke and RayRay. [emoji104] I post this in jest. Take no offense. [emoji111] Sent from an undisclosed location via Tapatalk

For the record, there has not been one drive by bayoneting in NJ since 1989.

Why does anyone buy a revolver that shoots shotgun ammo? Every time someone has evaluated that novelty its been shown to be less effective than any other traditional handgun for self defense. The answer? Because it's cool. The whole backbone of the pro 2a argument is that you should not have to show a reason or a purpose for buying any type of self defense tool. Why question the OP? To the OP; I don't like the idea, but if you do, rock on with yo bad self!

Let me cut this off right here.... Absolutely NOT ...... we eat our own enough here.... I can see NO positive outcome to having a DISLIKE button.....

Listen to the experts above. [emoji38] Sent from an undisclosed location via Tapatalk