Closet Gun Owners

[Ray Ray 3,566]

I was thinking of my neighbors with their:

 

Proud to be Liberal

Oh, Evolve

COEXIST

and a bunch more on the back of their mini-van.

 

The coexist one pisses me off! Always seems to be on sh!tbox.

[Twospot 38]

Any of you posters have a problem with me discussing this subject in detail on a future Gun For Hire Radio show? I may even do it the week we have Mak's on.

 

Names will be changed to protect the guilty of course.

That would be great. You can use my name lol. When I heard it this week I was ready for a long discussion . Since that didn't happen I'd love to hear it on another episode.

[Cemeterys Gun Blob 165]

I think a real closet to be would be the Dem/Liberal/Progressive gun owner. I know they're out their, but they are far from vocal about it, and the Left has done a hell of a lot to squash Lefty gun owners.

[Twospot 38]

 

 

The coexist one pisses me off! Always seems to be on sh!tbox.

+1 to that Ray Ray

[hd2000fxdl 422]

Any of you posters have a problem with me discussing this subject in detail on a future Gun For Hire Radio show? I may even do it the week we have Mak's on.

 

Names will be changed to protect the guilty of course.

 

Go for it Ant, and heck like I said, I don't care who know I am into guns, it's not like I hide it from people I know work with or for, and I have never hidden behind a fake name, I have used HD200FXDL for 10 to 11 years now and have always attach my real name to it, so no need for protection.

[Jon 264]

I talk about guns at work all the time. Everyone I work with owns one

[Guest]

Any of you posters have a problem with me discussing this subject in detail on a future Gun For Hire Radio show? I may even do it the week we have Mak's on.

 

Names will be changed to protect the guilty of course.

 

It's a valid topic to discuss......

 

However, why don't we engage and are somewhat ill at ease when.talking about firearms with those that might not see.it our way??

 

'they' have no qualms about attempting to force their ideals on us, so why should we be ashamed...?

 

That is one thing I do not get and I do not do...we can agree to disagree, but I will not shy away from my belief because it might not be popular....

 

But that's just me....

[bulpup 98]

Any of you posters have a problem with me discussing this subject in detail on a future Gun For Hire Radio show? I may even do it the week we have Mak's on.

 

Names will be changed to protect the guilty of course.

you can call me bulpup

 

 

Anyways, stickers on my car have to do with driving safely and making sure people think about motorcycles and texting behind the wheel and such. The other is an Army sticker. I just could not hold back the pride.

 

Gun stickers on a car is one less opportunity to tell someone to stop texting and drive. I can talk about shooting in a parking lot.

[Caine 147]

The only sticker on my car is the inspection sticker...

[gunforhire 826]

I think a real closet to be would be the Dem/Liberal/Progressive gun owner. I know they're out their, but they are far from vocal about it, and the Left has done a hell of a lot to squash Lefty gun owners.

 

Correct and right on point. I have had many, many students with left leanings, even ACLU cards in their wallets! They are in deep cover from family, coworkers, etc. How do you ferret them out? They hide their shooting from everyone. I had a Dr. take a lesson once because he found out by accident that the other three Doc's he had been golfing with for 12 years also went shooting but they never shared it with him. Hard the fathom.

[alowerlevel 77]

The only sticker on my car is the inspection sticker...

 

Same here. I have no need to have stickers, announcing that Im a gun owner, on my truck that is parked infront of my house.

The people I want to know I have guns, know. The people I dont want to know, dont know. And thats the way I like to keep it.

[notmetoo 41]

Correct and right on point. I have had many, many students with left leanings, even ACLU cards in their wallets! They are in deep cover from family, coworkers, etc. How do you ferret them out? They hide their shooting from everyone. I had a Dr. take a lesson once because he found out by accident that the other three Doc's he had been golfing with for 12 years also went shooting but they never shared it with him. Hard the fathom.

 

And yet they are willing to vote away their rights! Not just their privileges (for example having a local lib ray os a privilege) but Constitutional, God-given right to self defense. Liberals love to say conservatives are uneducated, ignorant fools yet it is so clear that they act and vote on the shallowest of reasons. They don't look deep, think things out, or consider the consequences of voting in "big government" (i.e. socialist) power grabbers.

 

Sigh, sorry, don't mean to take this thread too far off the rails. It's just infuriating trying to reason with some people.

[PK90 3,570]

I believe that a sticker or sign indicating that you have firearms in your home or possibly on your person would be more of a deterent to crime than an advertisement to steal or attack.

[bbk 188]

I believe that a sticker or sign indicating that you have firearms in your home or possibly on your person would be more of a deterent to crime than an advertisement to steal or attack.

I think it would be the first assumption, Paul, but I don't know if it holds up in the end. As you know from your own experience, crimes committed fall under two 'umbrellas,' generally speaking: crimes of opportunity and crimes of innovation.

• Opportunity: If someone leaves their garage door open, and has a number of valuables in the open for the grabbing, there is a probability it will be swiped.
  
• Innovation: On the other hand, if someone outwardly displays the fact that they possess valuables, including firearms, an individual or individuals can devise a plan/innovate and be on the offensive-- which in the rules of combat, or really two opposing sides meeting (like in sports for example), dictates the tempo and direction of the fight.
  

As I brought up in an earlier post, my former unit actually put out orders, not just a suggestion, that we weren't to outwardly display our affiliation to the military. This included military-themed license plates, bumper stickers, keeping military apparel in the POV, etc., as there had been a series of burglaries that targeted troops specifically because the assumption is that we kept firearms in our off-duty POVs. Sure we were based near a major city, but we were also in a very gun-friendly state.

 

I respect those who wish to outwardly display their passion and affiliation-- actually I commend it because it is necessary that there be a loud representation of the enslaved minority in this state. However, I'm going to stay a hard target because while it is unfair to compare how much it is that we have as individuals to lose [if we were targeted by "innovators], I do not want to be in any position to not be able to live to my full potential and/or provide for those in my life. But that's just me.

 

ETA: I think what would be interesting in this specific discussion is the real numbers of where illegal guns come from. Are they more from straw purchases, and/or illegally brought in from other areas [given they were bought legally]; or from thefts from homes, whether in this state or other states [or other countries].

[Krdshrk 3,877]

ETA: I think what would be interesting in this specific discussion is the real numbers of where illegal guns come from. Are they more from straw purchases, and/or illegally brought in from other areas [given they were bought legally]; or from thefts from homes, whether in this state or other states [or other countries].

 

Most I think are from thefts

[PK90 3,570]

Most I think are from thefts

 

I agree, but at what ratio to straw purchases? We can only guess. IMO, thefts 50 to 1.

 

Also, in reference to gun stickers, which is greater, a deterrent or an attractor? IMO, a deterrent 10 to 1.

[PeteF 1,044]

Also, in reference to gun stickers, which is greater, a deterrent or an attractor? IMO, a deterrent 10 to 1.

 

If you are home I'd agree it's a detterant, but as soon as you leave home its an attractor.

Generally you can't take your firearms with you so a thief knows there are likely firearms in the house

Making it a prime target.

[greatgunstatenj 32]

I don't have any stickers or other public displays but that is only because I never got around to it not that I'm vehemently against it.

 

As for discussions with anti gun libs, first thing I ask is whether they have ever discharged a firearm. If they say no I ask them if they would like to come to the range with me next time I go. If they say no, I tell them to STFU because I'm not arguing with someone who has no idea what they are talking and chooses to remain ignorant of the other side of the argument. That usually works.

[mcbethr 42]

I do not put any stickers on my car. Although I appreciate the irony that an NRA sticker would bring if placed on my hybrid.

 

I do own a Beretta hat, which I love, but I don't wear it that often because my kids gave me a Phillies hat that I have to wear out of obligation.

 

I also tend to wear 5.11 tactical pants every day, even to work (we are business casual, so they are worn with a polo or half-zip sweater). The 5.11 pants aren't making a tactical statement, rather the magazine pouch on the pants is the perfect size for my little cigar case.

 

All that being said, I don't hide being a gun owner at all, but I think I approach it in a different context. I usually tell people that I shoot clays, and they seem to understand that. They've watched the Olympics or have done it themselves on cruise ships. So I suppose I talk about it in the context of being a sport as in : "I'm taking off because I have a clay tournament on Friday." Nobody has ever given me a hard time, and the owner of my company is a major contributor to Rush Holt.

 

I've offered to take people from work and they have accepted and enjoyed it. Three women and one man from work has gone with me to the range, of that, two bought handguns after going through the paperwork.

 

I've also been open about taking days off to speak with Representative Greenwald after the magazine capacity bill was introduced last year. I was open about doing work for the pro 2A candidates in my district before the November election.

 

I think a lot of it is how you approach the subject. I'm a smoker, so I'm usually outside twice a day for a little cigar and I talk with the other smokers. Several of the women in our little smoking group don't think much of guns, but they are still interested when they ask me about my weekend and I say that I went to the range. I've never gotten any eye rolling, but I don't go into detail about El Presidente drills and so on. Nobody really cares, they just want you to say what you did over the weekend so they can tell you about theirs.

 

I think that a lot of it is how you approach the subject. If you are foaming at the mouth about 2A rights and the Gob'ment and self-defense and crime and concealed carry, people are going to roll their eyes. But if you go for the soft sell and treat your sport as no different than baseball, it will seem a lot more attractive.

[bulpup 98]

If you are home I'd agree it's a detterant, but as soon as you leave home its an attractor.

Generally you can't take your firearms with you so a thief knows there are likely firearms in the house

Making it a prime target.

 

I agree. The sticker may deter against violent criime or robbery, but burglary is the issue to think about. There is no way your gun, in its safe at home, while you are gone is going to prevent the guy that wants in. If anything it gives him something to look for.

[Caine 147]

I think the deterrent vs. attractor thing is just like the open carry vs. concealed carry argument. It's really not a black & white issue - in some circumstances it may be a deterrent.. in others, it might make you a target. My preference is to be low key with everything.. clothes.. cars.. whatever.. but I also think people, as a whole, suck.. so the less you know about me, the better.

[Luke_WO 11]

I agree. The sticker may deter against violent criime or robbery, but burglary is the issue to think about. There is no way your gun, in its safe at home, while you are gone is going to prevent the guy that wants in. If anything it gives him something to look for.

 

Yeah, but if we're thinking about burglary vs. robbery, I'd rather be burglarized than robbed. If I'm not home and someone breaks into my house and steals my guns, it's not the end of the world (yes it sucks, but it could be worse).

 

The much more dangerous and scary option is for someone to break into your house in the middle of the night and put you and your family in danger. That's the last thing I want.

 

So if putting a sticker on your house attracts burglary, but at the same time deters robbery, that's a chance I'm willing to take.

[bry@n 195]

I thought about this topic last night and wanted to add something. Crackaloon and I both work in the same office. Out of a crew of 15, 13 of us own firearms. My boss knows about it. We passa round the gun publications (guns & ammo, Handguns etc...) from desk to desk. We do have two other guys in the office that belong to NJGF but they are on a different crew and speak much less about guns then my crew does. lol

[PK90 3,570]

Yeah, but if we're thinking about burglary vs. robbery, I'd rather be burglarized than robbed. If I'm not home and someone breaks into my house and steals my guns, it's not the end of the world (yes it sucks, but it could be worse).

 

The much more dangerous and scary option is for someone to break into your house in the middle of the night and put you and your family in danger. That's the last thing I want.

 

So if putting a sticker on your house attracts burglary, but at the same time deters robbery, that's a chance I'm willing to take.

 

Actually, I'd rather be "Attempted Robbed" than be "Burglarized", because I will have the opportunity to prevent it. Being burglarized while not at home is shitty. Bring it.

[Luke_WO 11]

Actually, I'd rather be "Attempted Robbed" than be "Burglarized", because I will have the opportunity to prevent it. Being burglarized while not at home is shitty. Bring it.

 

Haha fair enough, Paul. I didn't include that third option in my list of hypotheticals.

[NicePants 58]

I guess I'm one of the lucky ones who has friends who like guns. Well, at least the close ones I have. Some I know don't care, and some of those facebook friends I have that I never talk to are typical liberals from back in high school. Actually, I find a good indication of whether or not a person will like guns to be if they like zombie stuff or not. All the people I know who enjoy zombie stuff have some level of interest in firearms.

[hd2000fxdl 422]

I believe that a sticker or sign indicating that you have firearms in your home or possibly on your person would be more of a deterent to crime than an advertisement to steal or attack.

 

I agree to a point Paul, now if I had the right to carry anytime I like it might be a different story. Also I think it also has to do with what area of the state and where you live.

[TheWombat 67]

Being fairly new to the US (2 years on Thanksgiving weekend) I had always perceived the US as a pro-gun country full of gun toting, gun mad people (sorry everyone!). I was not interested in guns when I arrived and I found the whole concept of civilians feeling they had to arm themselves for defense, or the 'right to bear arms' as an alien concept.

 

Now I've got settled in to the US I own firearms and use them for target practice and soon for competing, so it's more of a hobby. I applied and received my CCWs and will 'carry' when I go to PA over Christmas. I also 'carry' when in the house. Being totally honest neither of these latter two are (currently) due to a strong feeling of need for self-defense, which could at least be partially due to where we live and our lifestyle, however I would feel rather foolish in the event something did happen and I did not have a firearm available.

 

I've found in the office where I work that many people are anti-firearm and it is prudent to not therefore announce my hobby. This is no different to my perspective of not announcing my view on life/abortion, religion/faith/church/etc, mustang/camaro (ok I do announce that one at times). A few friends/colleagues know I have firearms however they are typically either from non-anti gun states or are recent migrants such as myself.

 

I don't wear badges or put stickers on my car for any affiliations/beliefs/viewpoints and never have, I believe in not preaching/forcing my views/beliefs to others out of respect for everyone being allowed their own viewpoint. If in a discussion and if it is appropriate then I do share my viewpoint and that I enjoy shooting however I do respect other people's views including the anti-gun contingent. Then again being recently arrived in the US I don't have the depth of emotion regarding the 2nd Amendment (sorry!)

 

I personally believe that putting NRA, SIG, Glock etc stickers on your vehicle is more likely to increase the risk of your car being broken into.

 

I also believe that (depending where you live) advertising that you have firearms could end up creating a 'neighbor from hell' type mentality where a neighbor could look for the slightest perceived transgression to report to the police. Also, depending if you are home all the time or not, it could increase the risk of a burglary. While many neighbors are not like this I am sure that statistically there are enough that are.

 

While somewhat off-topic, I do not believe that the open-carry YouTube videos (e.g. in Oregon) are helping the cause of having gun-owners being perceived as more responsible than the typical person (and we do need to be), and irrespective of our own viewpoints, there are sufficient firearm related incidents in the news every week (or so it feels) that I can understand why many people could have concerns regarding firearms.

 

It is therefore a fine balance between on one hand being in the closet, and on the other being seen as a gun-prophet/preacher/nut etc, neither extreme particularly helps the broader awareness of responsible gun-ownership.

 

While I don't know what the magic answer is for NJ, if we can at least increase the number of firearms owners e.g. by introducing new people into firearms as a hobby and increasing the number who actively participate in IDPA etc then we are likely to see an increase in gun-owners who see the value in the 'right to carry', and hence over time we could see a shift in perspective. However going straight for the jugular of 'right to carry' means that a significant proportion of the NJ population are not interested or have a negative view.. and hence the politicians are less likely to make it a priority to change. In fact as long as they perceive that more votes can be gained by being anti-gun/carry rather than pro-gun/carry, they will be anti-gun. We can show/preach statistics about how 'right to carry' will reduce crime till we die of old age and we can preach about the 2nd amendment however my personal view is it won't make a difference unless/until the politicians see a benefit in embracing this perspective.

 

I personally do not wear any clothing that announces I may be carrying a firearm, so I do not buy clothing with NRA logos, or tactical pens with Smith & Wesson on them etc. If you are unlucky enough to be involved in an incident it is likely to raise the chance of you being singled out (assuming the perpetrators have familiarity with these things). I do have an NRA hat and a Midway bag, however they are only worn/used at a range.

 

I also believe that the majority of civilians who carry (open or concealed) would 'screw up' in a real situation e.g. shooting at innocents, missing the perpetrators, or shooting the perpetrator when the 'threat' is moving away and no longer a threat, or just making a mess of drawing and either losing their firearm or being shot before they can effectively make use of their firearm. I have no hard evidence for why I have this viewpoint other than some basic psychology and a belief that many people are complacent/c-o-c-k-y and that fear/flight would overwhelm many people.

 

A little more than I had planned to write.

 

hth

 

TheWombat

[Soju 153]

 

I also believe that the majority of civilians who carry (open or concealed) would 'screw up' in a real situation e.g. shooting at innocents, missing the perpetrators, or shooting the perpetrator when the 'threat' is moving away and no longer a threat, or just making a mess of drawing and either losing their firearm or being shot before they can effectively make use of their firearm. I have no hard evidence for why I have this viewpoint other than some basic psychology and a belief that many people are complacent/c-o-c-k-y and that fear/flight would overwhelm many people.

 

 

TheWombat

 

Great post. I do however feel I need to comment on one thing (what I have quoted above).

 

I feel this is the reason why so many people are against firearms (amongst other things.) I am glad you said it however. I mean, you stated yourself, you don't know why you think that. There is nothing wrong with think that, but at the same time it doesn't mean you are correct either. And this is why there is such debate on the subject.

 

Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

[NJCK 5]

My gun "closet" is enormous so I wouldn't care...

 

In reality, I'm a proud gun owner/collector/competitor/instructor. You won't find me on social media of any sort beyond these forums, and I don't have any stickers whatsoever on my vehicles because I'm way to Type A for that. However, if you meet me in person, you'll see either an NRA Life Member or NRA Certified Instructor lapel pin on my coats, not uncommonly find me wearing a S&W cap, and regularly see me drinking my coffee in the office from one NRA mug or the other. Just like anything else, I judge my audience. Personally, I feel a responsible gun owner is one who is not in your face about it. I also have the same expectation for religious beliefs - it's a personal choice and I don't care to hear your opinion on it and don't try to jam it down my throat. Infringe on my rights - ANY of them - and I'm in the front of the line standing my ground.