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Shaneen Allen was a great case a few years ago in NJ that I thought had a shot at changing the law.  That story if it went to court would have gone nation wide. The one thing these politicians hate is a spot light on their unconstitutional laws. No way was a black divorced law abiding mother going to jail. That's the one that should have done it for us. If that couldn't break the chains that bind us here in NJ no other case will. 

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7 minutes ago, njpilot said:

So much for the saying " hollow points" are an add on charge. Not that these are considered hollow points by new jersikstan laws.

Wow. Great point!... and one that I totally missed on my first read-through. :blush: Your synapses are firing today, baby!  Better than mine, lol.

So far, it does sound like "driving while black". For now anyway, I'm feeling really bad for this young man. And my only (very slight!) hesitation on that is because this story is just coming out, and the sole article I've read is from pro-2A AmmoLand. I'm certainly willing to believe he's been treated unfairly, because we've seen it happen before... I'll be interested to see other coverage.

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5 minutes ago, PK90 said:

it's not an add on, it's a crime.

I know. I was just flushing out those that think it is; trying to get them to use their noodle.

"Add on crime" is just another creation of the mind of the misinformed NJ gun owners.

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I think by 'add-on", most people think the popo looks the other way, unless there is a more serious crime afoot, then they add the charge on, which may have occurred here and the real crime could not be proven, ie Al Capone.

ETA: To be clear, these were not hollow-points and the popo be wrong.

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We all huff and puff and preach to the choir when we hear these news reports because we are all so frustrated.  But this case really is the perfect storm.  First, the hollow point restriction is even more idiotic than your average NJ gun law.  Any person allowed to carry in NJ -- basically just retired cops and security guards -- is much more effective and much less of a risk to bystanders if he carries hollow points.  This isn't even arguable.  Second, the critical duty he was carrying is explicitly not deemed hollow point by the NJSP.  Third, he was following the law and being a good citizen in every single way: had a permit, coming back from work with gun stored properly, went out of his way to inform the police he was in possession of a firearm.  Fourth, he is black and as others have mentioned I think there is probably a good chance that he was profiled.

I suspect this case will be dropped quickly.  If not, I expect, hope and pray that he successfully sues the town for millions and wins a wrongful prosecution, civil rights case and anything else that sticks.

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4 hours ago, WP22 said:

I know. I was just flushing out those that think it is; trying to get them to use their noodle.

"Add on crime" is just another creation of the mind of the misinformed NJ gun owners.

We have had former LEOs on here in the past, state that they've never heard of anyone getting charged for possession of JHP Ammo if no other crime was committed, that it was always an "add on" charge.

Thats why I posted what I posted.

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6 hours ago, tony357 said:

If this is handled correctly he will not need a go fund me, this was blatant disregard for the law on behalf of the law. This is an over reach by this dept. 

 

This.

I would presume that the charges will be dropped.

I can't imagine a prosecutor actually moving forward with this.

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1 hour ago, Old Glock guy said:

Pretty sure Nappen doesn't work for free.  This is going to cost Twyne a lot of money, even if the charges are dropped. 

Hopefully Nappen doesn't charge for "publicity time" - he's another one in love with the cameras!  :facepalm:

If it turns out, as we suspect, that this arrest was bogus... I'd expect this young man would be seeing a legal bill not just in the $1000's, but easily into the tens of $1000's  - merely to get the charges dismissed/expunged and have his life returned to normal. Legal fees add up with shocking speed if the lawyer has a high hourly rate. He will also be out any lost wages while his security company had him suspended. Yeah, he'll owe a bundle. 

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6 hours ago, Mrs. Peel said:

Hopefully Nappen doesn't charge for "publicity time" - he's another one in love with the cameras!  :facepalm:

If it turns out, as we suspect, that this arrest was bogus... I'd expect this young man would be seeing a legal bill not just in the $1000's, but easily into the tens of $1000's  - merely to get the charges dismissed/expunged and have his life returned to normal. Legal fees add up with shocking speed if the lawyer has a high hourly rate. He will also be out any lost wages while his security company had him suspended. Yeah, he'll owe a bundle. 

And he should receive a bundle in the settlement as the police in this case were grossly incompetent.

I was discussing this with Cin last night. I said I would take a considerably lower settlement as long as I received a public apology from the involved officers and their chief at a town council meeting live streamed on youtube,  you know for posterity. She said they would never go for that, then my lawyers will pick their bones clean.

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With any luck, Nappen is taking the case on a contingency fee basis. No idea if he does such as thing, I don't know if he does civil plaintiff cases or strictly defensive.

Either way, this guy has no income, I doubt he's been suspended with pay. The least his employer could have done was reassign him temporarily to a position that does not require carry. I wonder if he belongs to a union? Probably not.

Cases like this are why I joined US Law Shield.

 

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20 hours ago, kc17 said:

With any luck, Nappen is taking the case on a contingency fee basis. No idea if he does such as thing, I don't know if he does civil plaintiff cases or strictly defensive.

Either way, this guy has no income, I doubt he's been suspended with pay. The least his employer could have done was reassign him temporarily to a position that does not require carry. I wonder if he belongs to a union? Probably not.

Cases like this are why I joined US Law Shield.

 

The employer should be paying his legal fees and any other bills since they provided him with the ammo. The police dept should be paying also for framing this guy.

 

 

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I think people say “add on” because the HPs are legal in the home and range (and business), right?

 

Maybe “add-on” is not the technical legal term...but it does specifically state that Hornady CD are ok.

Next we are gonna hear about the guy busted with the short-barreled Troy “Other” “Assault Rifle.”

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On 3/5/2020 at 11:53 AM, kc17 said:

I'm usually not big on lawsuits, but this guy should own the town when he's done.

 

The police officer and prosecutor should be personally liable as well and sued by the town that hired them as well as the victim. 

 

On 3/5/2020 at 1:10 PM, The_Matrix said:

should arrest and fire the cop.

And the government attorney that is overseeing this and hasn't thrown it out.

 

On 3/5/2020 at 1:43 PM, njpilot said:

So much for the saying " hollow points" are an add on charge. Not that these are considered hollow points by new jersikstan laws.

Yes, there are some FUDDs and LEO Fudds on here  that live in fantasy land and believe that a portion of the citizenry, including LEOs are actually virtuous American with common sense and a regard for just laws and personal freedoms and that would want the same justice afforded to them.   

I have had discussions with LEOs that said that common sense would be issued during these stops and then hypocritically turned around and told me flat out that they would just arrest and let it get sorted out at the station in cuffs.   For example legal long guns can be transported properly unloaded, cased and locked in the back of a vehicle pretty much all of the time unless you go where they are not allowed such as school property,  etc..  However, imagine getting pulled over ANY time by a LEO, and especially say at 11:30 at night.  Does anybody think that they would NOT be arrested on the spot?  

There are actually MORE restrictions with actual HP Ammo than there are with handguns per say, and the Federal Law that protects those passing through a state of tyranny doesn't hold up with HP ammo.  The funny thing, though, is that the man didn't actually HAVE HP Ammo. 

AND, as a armed-guard I would think just with many LEOs and court officials, he may have a justifiable need to have tinting on his windows to further protect him with his line of work.  

Where is the outrage that this respectable minority citizen was targeted... not that I have any qualms that a respectable caucasian non-illegal Alien would not have been victimized the same in New Jersey.

What is going on in Roselle Park?

 

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I guess the People's Republik is more treacherous than his job.  

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13 hours ago, Ray Ray said:

Pretty much sums it up.

That’s how I learned about it.  I donated because I feel for this guy. This guy has a job and is screwed, even if just for a while.  And that’s absolutely ridiculous.  
 

Perhaps there’s some claimed “legitimacy” to the cop’s decision (I haven’t seen the full list of charges is one correct inline with the NJ statues?) - I cant find it as I understand this person possessed the bullets due to being in direct transit from work to domecile with authorized possession at both.  But I hope regardless this brings focus on the idiocy of the laws, and, results in significant compensation to this person.  If not financially independent he’s probably more scared than anything. 
 

 

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On 3/5/2020 at 6:55 PM, njpilot said:

We have had former LEOs on here in the past, state that they've never heard of anyone getting charged for possession of JHP Ammo if no other crime was committed, that it was always an "add on" charge.

Thats why I posted what I posted.

Logically, by what other circumstances would the cops be searching you for hollow points? Most people dont carry firearms in this state..

So it makes sense that an LEO would not know of someone being charged without accompanying other criminal offenses.

I've never heard it considered an add on charge by any LEO on this board, current or former.

The only add on charge in this state I'm aware of is body armor, since the law states "while in the commission of a crime"

 

 

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